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New machine finally!

Discussion in 'Smartphones, Computers, Gaming and Networking' started by cjd, May 30, 2007.

  1. cjd

    cjd New Member

    My monitor upgrade forced a PC upgrade. ;) Nothing fancy - AMD X2 4800+ Brisbane, 7950GT/512 (fanless), 2GB of RAM. I don't notice it being faster, which isn't really surprising. I mean, it IS a good deal faster, but most of my use isn't on things that really taxed the old system, so the new system isn't going to really help. My old video card just didn't have the video memory to support Beryl properly, and there were some other signs.

    What interests me most, however, is that it was 4 hours from parts to having Ubuntu fully installed and running and in the same condition it had been on my old machine, including all the programs I use or want installed, settings, etc. Almost completely painless.

    Windows also has ~4 hours into it so far and that's just OS, patches, and drivers. Doesn't count hardware assembly. No programs installed yet. I suspect it will be well over ten hours before I'm through with Windows, unless I find a shortcut somewhere to bring over all my preferences and program installs. Makes me wonder if it's worth it. If I didn't have some programs I wanted to use that require Excel + VB, and Photoshop... And I'm already giving very serious consideration to just going VMare and forgetting about having Windows installed directly.

    Whee. :)

    Should be getting the right bracket to install the Thermalright XP-120 I got, as well as a pile of Yate Loon 120mm fans (they're the same as the Nexus fans at 1/3 the price and are black not orange...) So shutting the system up completely will be my next task.

    Have to track down what causes the sound card to output this nasty squeal too. On-board as well as a PCI card have the same problem (M-Audio Rev 7.1). Really weird.

    C
     
  2. AndrewM

    AndrewM New Member

    Try this with Windows - http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/setup/expert/crawford_november12.mspx

    4hrs for just the OS and patches is WAY too long, we're moving to images here at work, but before that a base OS install/patches and nothing else would take about 1-1.5hrs or so (if it takes much longer the big-bad-boss man *me* wonders what's going on), we could flip a developer machine in about 6hrs, that includes a fresh OS install, Office package, all software installs according to spec (VS2003 takes nearly 2hrs to install just by itself), and everything patched to spec and then it's all moved to it's owner and all files moved over (although a lot of stuff is kept on the network, which reduces file transfer times by a good chunk). Also we have everything already in house for patches/service packs/etc, so the "download" time is a bit quicker on a Gb network vs the typical home connection ;)

    Also once you're done, ghost it and keep the image some place handy, so the next time you need to go back to a base install you have it available. If you're really brave you can also use that image with new hardware most of the time, but you could end up spending time fixing driver issues which never get resolved so you start from scratch anyway (I'd say about 15-20% of the time for us here).
     
  3. cjd

    cjd New Member

    2 problems with that - I did look into that tool since it advertises itself on install.

    1. These Windows machines don't like seeing each-other on the network regularly. Well, I've not had the new machine on Windows enough to see, but the 3 others in the house have only like twice EVER managed to talk to each-other properly in over 2 years of trying every so often because I wanted to use the printer, or at least open the file on my wife's machine to print, or...

    2. From the link: "All your programs must be reinstalled on the new computer, because actual programs are not migrated by the Files and Settings Transfer Wizard. Moreover, some programs have to be installed before their settings are transferred."

    Settings are not the biggest problem. I keep a clean desktop and adding programs to quick launch is simple once they're installed. It's installing the programs that takes time. In fact, some settings I probably don't want to migrate, since directory/drive structure is different (OS is always ALWAYS on a different partition. I've already moved the gigabytes of data and personal files as part of the linux migration)

    The ~4 hours included 3 failures in applying patches (why did they fail? Who the heck knows.) requiring a retry after reboot as well as the downloads (~1mb/sec average). I bet an hour of that was just downloading stuff. I thought about bringing the machine into work. :) It's longer than I would have guessed. Some of it is going out and finding the latest drivers, bios patches, etc. So some of it is probably not fairly Windows specific issues. But then, hardware wasn't fairly just a Ubuntu issue, so I figured it evens out.

    I'll probably not bother installing WoW in Windows after all which will save a LOT of time. So just Excel, Word (why WHY do people insist on getting a resume as WORD.doc - what's wrong with PDF?!), Acrobat, Photoshop, Macromedia suite, Canon software for dealing with RAW images (though I'm looking for one that works in Linux), plus setting up Thunderbird and Mozilla to properly find the shared install profiles... Of those, RAW file manipulation and the VB scripts in Excel are the only things that fail under WINE (though I've had some funkiness with Fireworks under WINE - rather, with the saved files, but not sure why... yet...) Photoshop supposedly works but I've not taken the steps for that yet. My Wacom may not work quite as well though, so just that will also keep me with Windows around.

    Not gonna go shell out any cash for Ghost. Not worth it. Where do I put it? That's another hundred bucks in hardware/software. I already back up my data. I didn't find I had to do annual re-installs of XP, and I already know better than to bother with trying to use Ghost to move it to a new PC (plus, that would cause me to have the same OS license on 2 computers since the old machine usually goes to my wife or to some other use and ends up keeping the OS...)
     
  4. AndrewM

    AndrewM New Member

    It's hard to comment since I'm a very senior Windows guy and maybe a mid-level (probably more like a Jr-Mid level) *nix guy, so things like the networking issues just don't really happen on my end, setting up a workgroup takes about 15 minutes and everything talks to each other nicely, quick and easy.

    Nothing, except that Adobe Acrobat has maybe the worlds worst editing functions. Plus PDF files can be as big of a security risk as DOC files, except it's a lot easier to neuter Word/Excel/etc than it is Acrobat. I know a lot of companies that have killed off accepting PDF attachments because of that alone. Plus the "free" PDF writers out there generally work well enough, but that doesn't mean there may not be compatibility issues, we've run into a few of them over the years, some of our software makes PDF reports, which are written by a 3rd party component, so when that report comes out it's not always compatible with all Adobe PDF readers (I recall at one time the report was 7.x and later compatible, however this was right when 7.x came out, so most people still had 5.x-6.x installed).

    There are some free/GPL programs out there that do the same thing. I'll have to see if I can dig up the links (it's been a few years since I've used them).
     
  5. cjd

    cjd New Member

    This is the first time I've ever had problems with Windows networking. Just XP. With 2000 and before, no problems. I used to run an ISP so... not exactly clueless in that area. ;) A little out of touch. I think it's an issue with the driver for the on-board NIC on the 2 XP machines I have (same motherboard). Pings work, but I can't connect to a share via IP.

    I have a real copy of Acrobat. I set copy in whatever program I choose and print to PDF, so editing functions are a non-issue. The real issue is, I don't want to have to own the software (Word) JUST for that. Seems silly. I do (probably stretching license as I acquired it as a student) so I don't fret it too much, but... Maybe it's just that I use Acrobat for so much more (printing receipts to PDF when I make online purchases or pay bills, that kind of thing). I only use Word for the resume.

    As for Ghost, come to think of it I can probably just do the entire system backup from Linux including the Windows partition. Since GRUB lives in the boot sector I think there would be no complexities at all.

    I think there are two different issues on the ease of migration: First, Ubuntu includes an awful lot by default, and Aptitude makes getting anything else painless. 7.04 is far ahead of even where 6.10 was. So, the latest Firefox was already there. Thunderbird was one quick command away (or a checkbox in the GUI if I used that instead). Second, and probably what I hate most about Windows over even DOS: all user specific program data is in a directory, not the registry. It's all in the user's home directory. (yes, a lot is done this way again in Application Data, so that's good). So it's a quick copy to migrate.
     
  6. Drew

    Drew Well-Known Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    Turn your modem volume off. ;)
     
  7. cjd

    cjd New Member

    That is about what it sounds like. Nah, it's a single frequency at ~10kHz I would guess. Disabling USB, network, yanking all the fans - none of it worked. I'm going to double check the headphones here in a bit on the off chance something happened to them but they were working fine on the other system...

    New fans are in. Thing is dead quiet. It almost isn't on. :) And it's at whatever the motherboard thinks fan speed should be.

    C
     

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