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Ok Rich, help me build an IB

Discussion in 'DIY Lounge' started by chad, May 10, 2007.

  1. chad

    chad Active Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    Room is 16'x'12'x8. It has 2 entry ways. I can go into the garage or attic, but, I would prefer the garage as I don't want to wake up the kids in the back of the house. The room is on a slab, the exterior walls are brick and interior are drywall. I would like to stay with 2 drivers to start. I use a single 12" sub now and it does the job nicely so I guess 2 15" drivers should easily do the job.

    Budget, well, its going to be a piece by piece project but I can't go too crazy with it.
     
  2. cjd

    cjd New Member

    I'd go a pair of 18's from FiCarAudio or Mach 5 and a Behringer A500 amp. ~$750.

    While not the most bang for the buck as far as displacement, the Dayton IB subs are still good stuff and quite affordable. I'm driving a pair with one of their 240W plate amps - picked up the whole set when stuff was on sale for ~$300 total.

    How's room placement in the spots you'd like to use? Put your sub there and measure, or put your sub in the hot seat and measure where you think you'll install... Make sure to do measurements from a few spots in the general area, nodes can be oddly peaky. See where works best acoustically of your options.
     
  3. chad

    chad Active Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    While the ~ 300 is closer to what I am looking at, I am still open. My sub is currently exactly where the IB will be. Only concern is... My screen takes most of the wall. If I stack the drivers one will be partially behind the screen. I would probably loose some corner gain if I put them side by side instead of top to bottom, right?

    How do I know if I need an EQ?
     
  4. Michael M

    Michael M Active Member

    What about building a manifold? Have you checked out 'The Cult' website?
     
  5. chad

    chad Active Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    Yeah, I have done lots of reading at the cult site. I am less that good at wood working so I don't think that would work too good for me.
     
  6. cjd

    cjd New Member

    So, I built my first manifold with nothing but a jigsaw, glue, and drywall screws. Lots of screws, yes, temporarily in the place of clamps.

    Precision is NOT needed. :)

    The mechanical cancellation of opposed mounted drivers can really be a benefit. If there's room behind for such a "box" I'd do that. If you build it ~36" tall, 18" deep, and 12-15" wide you can get away with a mouth ~18" tall (taller is still worth doing if there's room) and very handily toss 4 of your chosen driver into the manifold, such that if you find two isn't enough...

    C
     
  7. Rich Kraus

    Rich Kraus Active Member

    get a local home center to cut the boards for you, and then you only need to cut the holes. when we built mikes, we cut the holes with a rotozip tool. less than a presision operation. came out great.

    if teenagers can build sub for their cars, you can do this.

    id do a manifold if i could. opposing drivers cancels mechanical vibration. ive done it both ways, and like the manifold. (my current situation requires a line array though)

    PE IB's, tempest classics, or any of thomasW's current recomendations for drivers will work fine.

    i used a plate amp mounted in the wall last time, and a regular component amp this time. both work great.

    about the garage. garage doors resonate pretty bad. might want to stick your curent sub out there and bang away a bit. find out what sort of door resonance your neighbors will be dealing with.

    other than that... make your best guess, cut a hole, enjoy :)

    the cult is a great resource, but id be happy to help any way i can.
     
  8. Michael M

    Michael M Active Member

    The Tempests are almost gone once again. Kyle Richardson said he has about 12-15 left. They are on sale for $135 each. EXCELLENT price for those drivers.

    Acoustic Visions/Tempest Classic
     
  9. Chris White

    Chris White New Member

    The setup Chris described, 2-15" drivers and a 240W plate amp will provide you with reference levels of bass in that size room. My concern with a garage placement would be excess sound levels outside your home.
     
  10. E Jones

    E Jones Active Member

    chadci,

    Where you located?

    -EJ
     
  11. chad

    chad Active Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    I am just a little south east of downtown Indianapolis, In
     
  12. chad

    chad Active Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    I am so horrible about starting threads and forgetting about them.... sorry.


    I guess doing a manifold would not be entirely out of the question. I am going to take the sub to the garage in the next day or two and see what happens. I don't think I can get it into the attic though, but it would sure be a good test to do.

    The garage door is solid wood and I am not opposed to putting some sort of foam on it if that would help any, there is also a back door but again, it is wood with a window, but, it is covered and again, I could put foam on it , all but one of the walls in there are brick so that should be of some help, right? There is a good 30' between houses and her wall closest to mine is her garage and she has brick as well. As it is now, my system cranked more than I would ever care to listen to it is only audible about 5' in front of the house, nothing outside the garage or in the back. The interior walls are pretty thin but thats not of great concern as it does not seem to bother the kids much when we watch a movie at night, I just don't know how an ib would be if it is in the attic.

    If I do 2 of the Dayton 15's how much power do I need? I got a P.E catalog yesterday and they have Bash 300 and 500 watt amps on sale for not much more than $100 - $150, if I can do the whole shabang for $400 it would be soopa doopa.
     
  13. Rich Kraus

    Rich Kraus Active Member

    you dont have to get *in* the attic to do an attic install, depending on how you do the wiring, it can al be done from in the room if there is enough clearence. its the clearence issue that forced a line array for me this last install. looking back, if i had adjusted my mounting location a couple feet i could have done a manifold....

    a wood garage door probably wont be an issue, most of the doors down here are the stamped steel things (mine included) and they resonate horribly when excited by a proper sub.

    garage will probably be ok. (though your on the right path to do a few quick tests if thats practical.

    after that, time to pick where the sub will go in the room. again a floorplan would be helpful, but anywhere along the front wall is a good start.

    for 2 of the daton IB 15's, 200-300 watts will be plenty. youll run out of excursion before you reach the thermal limits of most drivers when in an IB.

    I run 2 TC sounds 15's in my 12X15X10h room (sealed room) and its plenty for me, (i had 2 tempest 15's in a larger room before, and that worked good too).
     
  14. chad

    chad Active Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    Sorry Rich, I don't mind getting in the attic to do the install, I just don't want to lug my current sub up there to do a test. I am working on getting some pictures up so you will have a better idea of what I am working with. My room is just about the same size as yours, but with an 8' ceiling.

    This is my first wood garage door as well. This house is about 40 years old and it is orginal to the house. I am not overly worried about the neighbors hearing anything. Granted this is a VERY QUIET neighborhood and I would not want to be the noisy guy on the block, what I am doing now at insane levels far beyond what I would listen to is not audible more than a few feet from the front of the house. My biggest concern about going attic is that the sound will travel to the kids room and keep them up.
     
  15. Rich Kraus

    Rich Kraus Active Member

    ok, garage it is. you wouldnt be the first :)

    soooo....

    now you need to finalize your driver and amp choice, and spend some money. :) while stuff is on the way, we can work through building a manifold and talk about install.

    i take more of a seat of the pants approach to IB location, putting it where it "makes sence" if you want to talk about bass wave lengths and try to figure out possible nulls, now would be a good tme to check out the cult forum . thomas and the guys over there know this stuff backwards and forewards.
     
  16. Michael M

    Michael M Active Member

    The easiest way is to put the sub where you normally sit, then go around the walls or ceiling where you may want to put the IB. Where the bass sounds the best, not necessarily the loudest, that's where you put the manifold. It's much easier than moving the big ol' sub around the room!!!
     
  17. chad

    chad Active Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    Michael, that is what I normally do, but I already have the location picked out for the IB. The issue at hand is if I want to go into the attic or the garage. I can do either in the location. Problem with the attic is it will spread bass through the house, problem with using the garage is it might spread bass outside of the house. Should not been too much of an issue as the neighbors house is not that close but we live on a quite block and I don't want to be "that neighbor"
     
  18. Rich Kraus

    Rich Kraus Active Member

    i ought to throw out there that a good IB located anywhere will spead bass through the whole house.

    strong bass is hard to contain. ask those kids in the boom cars.
     
  19. chad

    chad Active Member War Zone Member Top Poster

    Thats a good point Rich. We did some movie watching this weekend. The twins were at their fathers house and the other kids were watching the movie. I excused myself to use the restroom ( I don't want to look like a total geek) but really snuck around doing some testing. I went into each of the kids bedrooms and waited for LOUD. It did not seem to matter much where I was it was pretty intense. We watched the first half of Kindgom of Heaven last night after the kids went to bed, I don't know how they slept! My current sub is less than anything special. It is a JBL E250p and while it did it's job well in a duplex it is time to move on to the family room.

    Thats my current plan. All of my existing gear is going to move to the family room , she is ok with that.... she wants to watch Murder She Wrote in surround sound... Not sure how thats going to be.. not sure I want to find out!
     
  20. Michael M

    Michael M Active Member

    I would be curious to find out which members here have mounted an IB in their garage and hear a lot of bass outside with the garage door closed. I have mine in the attic, and while it rocks the house inside, I can barely hear it outside. And once I get about 20ft from the house, I you wouldn't know I had anything cranked up to reference level inside.
     

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